@thornAvery Eheh, it's fine. I didn't know that actually, I'm still learning category stuff and have only applied it to topology so far, I haven't seen how it relates to Haskell other than just intuition
Hopefully that will change soon, it's one of the topics I'm thinking about looking into for my master's thesis
@socks ah you’re probably ahead of me, I started Hasklel and since then hav ebeen trying to learn more category theory
the shitpost comes down to (at least in my understanding) that a lot of haskell’s category theory pretends that values cant crash or hang forever because otherwise a lot of assumptions break, so all the category theory holds up but theres a big asterisk for *unless something crashes or hangs forever
@socks I thought the behaviour of monads was dependent on knowledge from category theory, so to use them properly you had to know it <:O
At least that's when i was last looking into it like 5 years ago lol
its what stopped me from learning it, I was like "im going to learn category theory first" and watched some lectures, then that slowly got shunted off my todo lol
@alexandria In my experience, not at all. You can absolutely use monads in Haskell without knowing what they are in the category theory sense!
@socks @alexandria To add anecdotal evidence to this, I learnt Haskell monads before learning category theory monads. And in one of our courses, we teach monads in functional programming and definitely don't assume category theory. (See https://lean-forward.github.io/logical-verification/2020/)
Basically, the only 2 parts of FP monads you need to understand category theory for, is why they have this name and why people say "a monad is just a monoid in the category of endofunctors, what's the problem?"
At least we got a great parody called "Burritos for the hungry mathematician" out of it: https://emorehouse.wescreates.wesleyan.edu/silliness/burrito_monads.pdf
@Vierkantor @socks I think at that time I actually had the patience (read: being forced into a 30m train journey every day) to read about type theory, set theory, SPJ's book on making programming languages, and category theory
not only did i learn a bunch, but ive already forgotten like 90% of it 😂😂😂
Emil Socks' personal instance!